Every design thinking process, no matter what the variation, starts from the problem space research, and then we move towards the solution space. [Applause] [Music] Welcome back, listener, to another exciting episode. In this episode, we will be discussing the design thinking process, how we can design big applications, and what is the thinking required behind it so that we can give an optimal user journey for all the clients, all the stakeholders, and all the people who are using that particular platform. And to discuss this topic in detail, we have invited a design expert with us today, Asad. How are you, and kindly introduce yourself to the audience. Thank you for inviting me on this podcast. I'll just start with a brief introduction. As you said, my name is Asad. I am a co-founder in an AI product development consultancy known as Bytecorp. And what we do is we partner up with technical founders and help them build their products from end to end. And we have helped multiple founders from Silicon Valley and beyond, today's multiple million in funds in.

seat funding than Beyond and yeah so I would say that we have been quite successful in that. So the consultancy started back in 2019, and it has been what I think like four, four and a half years. Yeah, that's been going fine, alhamdulillah. So, tell us about your experience specific to design, like what you are up to in the design industry, like what you have done in the previous years. All right, so just like a brief background. I started up as a front-end developer, and during that, I kind of found out my calling in the sense that most of the impact that I'm making is coming from a designer who's giving me his design advice and who is designing the whole experience and the roadmap of how the things are going to be. So, then I pivoted towards design full-time, started studying it, pursued multiple specializations, then UX design, and then I was outsourced to a web3 startup known as Anmol for as a lead on their product.

experience okay, and we help them raise a million dollars in seed. And in that moment, I kind of wanted to say, Okay, this is where most of my impact would rely on, and I think this is where I can do much good. And I think even in the recent past year and a half, we have been working with multiple startups. There was one automobile company; we have helped them raise upwards of five million dollars. And there were other small startups who have raised some funding because of the first. So, I have been full-time involved in designing those products. Okay, so can you explain, like, because for our listener, like, what is the design thinking process? Like, if, for instance, I'm the automobile owner, I have like two, three shops, and I come up to you and I said, I need like a crazy design. And for a person like it can be like a person, a layman who does not know much about websites and all that. It is user-friendly for them as well. And so, what is the starting

process like can you guide me yeah sure thing sure thing so so every design thinking process no matter what the variation it's start from the problem space research and then we move towards the solution space so how it goes like it's that we first diverse towards the problem and we are taking all the input that we can so if um let me think of an example yeah so if this automobile company says that there's a lot of manual paperwork that we do and we want to get rid of this so we try and ask them more questions around it then why would you want to zero in on this and then just as an example we find out okay they just want to they just want to do it so they can save a huge amount of time and then if we keep pulling down to it we then realize okay this is just this aspect of paperwork if we digitize it then there is the major impact of of uh time getting remaining for them to focus on other things and then we move towards the solution space as to what we can design.

for only that purpose, and if we digitize that, the problem is solved. Does that make? Yeah, that is good. Like, it has basically Two Face First. You understand the manual process and how things work, and once you understand the vision of the particular customer, like why they want to digitize it or why they want that particular feature, then you guys start with the solutioning of it, like how we guys can solution. Exactly, exactly. In simple words, we keep zeroing in on the problem unless we see it's simple enough to solve. Sure. And you have mentioned that these companies, some of these companies, they have like get some fundings as well. So what's the relation with that? Like, can you explain? Yeah, sure thing. So whenever we get involved with the consultancy, so the understanding is like they have these limited amount of funds that they're going to utilize to build this product, and we are going to help them. As it always starts with the design phase or

in better yet, the discovery phase of the problem, and after that, we come up with the main problem definition. So, okay, this is the problem that you're trying to solve. We ideate on it, we keep building variations, we test it with their target audience, and this target audience is something that they have to provide. Okay, this is why I'm, this is the problem, and this is the audience that I'm building it for. Okay, we get them on call, we test it with them, and then we built the MVP, a bare minimum MVP, in a sort of way that they can, okay, take this, and then they can start pitching it to the investors, and then they, okay, raising funds like that. Yeah, yeah, okay, okay, get it. I get it because nowadays, like, it's all about MVP. Previously, I remember, like, people, clients, and even, like, a lot of people, like, a majority of them, you know, come up to you and say, like, you know, I need this big giant system. I need that. I need, like, this kind of a design. I need an admin portal, client.

portals and all that like it used to be like a huge system. It takes like years to basically, you know, it takes first like a few months to actually create the design of it, create business flows, and then develop it, testing. And now, like, I see like a lot of the industry is pivoting towards the MVP approach. A lot of people are like building SAS platforms, and AI is also very in. Like, I see like in today's market, like every product I see, every new product, there is some AI aspect involved. Like, either it is chat GPT API or like, you know, more about it. So, can you tell like any exciting AI-related product you have designed or like you have you guys did plan and make it like into a successful MVP? So usually, so usually you're definitely right that there is this glorified inclination towards AI that they have to do something in it, which, you know, so it becomes a better product to pitch in front of the investors because they are the CF AI boom and being 100.

transparent. So, we do find some aspect of any, uh, like some aspect of AI involved in the product that we can utilize. But in any product, the AI part cannot, can, can’t be involved just from day one. Like in most of the products we have worked in, there are products which are totally AI-based, uh, but, uh, in my experience, we need to collect the data for it first to come up with something that, okay, which we can later utilize to go with that. And, uh, the point that you mentioned about building now the industry being more focused towards coming up with Mbps, that is something that we definitely agree on because now these processes are more outcome-based, and they need to, they need to, they need to focus on what they're going to ship. And incidents have happened where clients have, in meetings with us, they have insisted that they want the admin panel and everything, and you know, each and every of a product that is not usually, uh, centered around a problem that they're trying to solve. But then it gets easier when we tell them the whole

timeline of what they are envisioning and the cost behind it. And then they get, and then, and then, then it gets easier because, okay, we can't invest that much in it. So, what do you suggest? How much we can cut down? And then, they start like a bottom-up approach so they can cut down enough till it becomes an MVP. And then, it gets easier to build on, to build it. Yeah, that is good, that is good. And for any listener who is listening and you guys have any idea in your mind that you're thinking like, This is like a crazy idea. I would say like, Yesterday, there's like the right person. You can contact him on LinkedIn as well. I will provide your LinkedIn link in my description so that you can discuss with him. He's like the expert in designing flows and stuff, and you guys like workout, and you guys build something crazy. So, yeah, yeah. And the next is, yeah, and the next thing is like, What are like if we go in more detail regarding like the designing principle because

Whatever you do, whatever product you build, it starts from designing it, and then obviously the development part, and testing, and all that. So, what are the key principles that we have to focus on in the design thinking process? So, like, I won't call them principles per se, but, um, like, what I have learned in my experience is that we learn a lot of things when we are studying design, even the design thinking process. So, there is, so, when we empathize, then we define, then we ideate, then we test, then we, you know, then we ship it. So, but it is really different in the real world. So, in the real world, if you just try to follow the process just for the sake of the process, it is never going to work. I mean, I think 90% of the time, it's not going to work because the client won't have the capacity for it. They won't, you won't have the resources to test everything, you, and you won't have the time, at least, and, and soon as an

investor get in gets involved. You don't have the time at all to be this flexible about everything. So, and another definition, like you have to be flexible about the process. So, if a client needs something like a process that you know and you have seen in other products that is consistent, then you don't generally, you don't have to like go all in on the research. You come up with interviews and things. You know how it's done. So, you have to at least start the low Fidelity outside, like wireframe it, get it reviewed with the client, and then mock it up to show it to the users. And it has to be very quick. So, even a lot of the designers, junior designers, which I have spoken to, complain about this, that we don't get the capacity to do what we want to. And you know, we want to do wireframe, we want to test it on the wireframe, and then we want to build the

mock-offs and then on what they fail to realize is um that the ux the ux value Loop as much as focused on the users and we keep saying the user Center there as much as focus on the users it has to be focused on the business as well because that's that's where the food chain is coming from so if you can't generate value for the business they won't be they won't be able to invest likewise to generate value for the users and it has to be and it has to be like both ways it just can't be heavier on months on it yeah I also believe that because I have also worked with like uh different SAS platforms uh and we raised some funding from UK and uh a lot of them are UK based so I also remember we used to get like uh some requirements we can add this particular screen and on the same day we used like designers are like preparing like figma files like instantly we get the figma we show the to the client and clients say okay okay

and it's not like the whole process builds and then after two days we show it to the client. It's like instant, instant in MVP. We get on a call with the client and maybe there are changes going on and the client is telling you, you know, change the font, change this thing, like move a little bit down. And like, uh, maybe like the whole team is on the call, uh, all the senior members, they're checking it out, discussing the design is final after like one day or two days. That particular feature is developed into the system. So, but like there's another aspect of it as well, like if you're working with like a big company who have several, who have like funds or the product is generating like good revenue in that. Like I have personally seen as well that they are following the process because as you said, like it is like a very practical thing that you said, like obviously if it is like MVP and you guys are launching in the market and obviously at that, you also have to keep in mind like we have the runway for like

seven months, so whatever we have to finish the development in like five months. The next two months, we will like market it, and then we will pitch it to investors, and we will show them the user retention and all that. So, you have to keep all of that in mind, like the runway and how in that runway that your investor or client has, how you have to build everything and like get investors. So, yeah, that is, I would say, like for someone who is like thinking about like designing or starting their own product, it's like it's very helpful for them just to get their head clear. There's just one more point that I would love to mention here because there is also this other side of the story, which you mentioned beautifully, that there are companies who are now by status, who have the investment, who have the runway to do with the right thing, then do it, doing them the right way. Yeah, but I've seen, I've also experienced that with designers, this

becomes a habit when they're in a very fast-paced environment. So now, so now they're in the habit of not testing anything at all. Oh, I'm not doing employee search and anything. So, there is a middleware, there is a fine line of things which you know about how, Okay, how these are, how this experience will perform with any expert user. But then, there are a whole, there's a whole plethora of ways that it can go when you are involved in an uncharted territory. So, whenever you have the capacity and any, you think this is the time that we need to test it, and you're going to test it, and you're going to involve the users earlier on to save the cost. Because if it's built, and then there's the user feedback, the look, you know, This is where you, this was very open that you know you have to move it there. We have, we have, we need, oh, we need this feature this way, or it should be the other way around. Then you, then you would have to

not just you have to remember it a little bit, but then it will have to. There's that development cost involved with it. Again, this thing will be pushed into that pipeline, and the developers will work on it again. But this is something that it's the design responsibility to save that cost and ask the organization. And, you know, a big part, a big part of a designer's role is to make the stakeholder understand about the design station. And if they're failing to do that, then there's this needs putting on. And so, they need to make them realize with stories, with actual metrics, with numbers, Okay, this is how we can save this amount of money if we do this right now. And I think any reasonable stakeholders is going to act upon it because they need to save money or they need to make. Yeah, and like, can you tell us about, like, for instance, the product, the MV is like, let's say in the market, it is doing good. There are like some x amount of users started using it, some investors.

are also showing interests, and things are going good. And then you have to take the user feedback that this particular platform, for instance, you guys invented some sort of chat GPD platform, and you guys wanted to know how the customers are liking it or not. So, how you guys get that metrics, like what are the different ways to get the customer feedback and improve there. Like, there are a couple of ways to do it. So, if you have a hypothesis, see, so if you think, for example, if you have this hypothesis, Okay, feature X will perform better if it's Y way. Okay, if you have the hypothesis, then you can come up with a survey, and then you can get some of the users, you can email some of the users, and be very, very concise with the question that you want to know because they don't have the time. You know, you must have seen some NPS service which go like, Not often, very often, likely, very likely, not likely at all, and they're like five to six.

uh circles which you can choose from so they can be cut down into two choices yes or no because you don't like it and everything between is answered and answered between it and even if you can deliver into one question in in in in this in this way surveys are very successful yeah if you are being if you are throwing a survey out in the dark and you are asking everything okay what do you think if you do it this way and and if it's that way see we never asked to use this for solution yeah yeah we ask them what the problem is but they have the tendency to tell them okay this is a problem and I think you should do it to solve it yeah but you cannot act upon it because if you ask seven of them they're going to be seven probable Solutions it's your job to come up with the solution that Tech is all of it so you so you get the feedback to understand the problem not the solution you need to come up with a solution so this is one way so service

work when you have the hypothesis for it, and if it's a little broader than that, then you can conduct interviews, you can ask some open-ended questions, you can, you need to focus on your expressions, you need to focus on, okay, where they're, where they are having difficulty, not just where they are saying that they are having difficulty, where they're actually having difficulties. So, what they say and what to do, a lot of clients have a lot of different, yeah, I think these are a couple of ways that you can, you know, get right on the track when you get better feedback and to improve the product. Yeah, because I have also experienced it, like, in a lot of platforms, like, they are asking some of them, it is very easy, as you mentioned, like, yes, no, some of them, there are, like, lengthy forms, and I also remember, if there is, like, a lengthy form, you're, if you are busy, you're like, okay, man, like, I don't have time for it, and you'll press on cancel or, like, I will do it.

later sometime or maybe not, you know, and then, uh, also like I have been involved in like, uh, with Sentry recently. Like someone from the Sentry team, they messaged me like, yeah, they need to get the user feedback and stuff, and uh, in return, they will do this ex-favor for me, and uh, I was like, okay. Then they conducted like a whole series of like, um, you can say interviews, and it was not just me, so it was like I worked in basically a Norwegian company. We were developing a fintech application for them, so we also involved like, uh, I involved like other team members as well, like the app developer, the front end, and I was, uh, I basically handled the whole cloud and the solutioning part. So, and then they were asking, you know, what are the metrics that the app guy needs, the back end, front-end, and it was like a long meeting. It was very helpful for us as well because they are obviously getting the feedback from the right person, and then they have multiple meetings, they are giving us the feedback.

We are implementing it, then they're again getting the feedback, and then in that particular, you can say like five-six meetings, we also added like a lot of things into our platform, and it was not planned. Like it was like all of the seven, and then the client loved it, and the client was like, you know, there is like a lot of like, it is like a monitoring platform in logging. So yeah, so it can be a good case, and I always like, you know, giving feedback or like having quick calls with companies because nowadays like a lot of them are emailing you or for a quick like five-ten minutes chat regarding the quick feedback of the new X feature they have developed. So yeah, it is good. Yeah, definitely, I totally agree. And then I would just say that a successful product for me is not a milestone, it's a process, and a lot of it depends on, you know, learning the right ways to get the feedback. Yeah, you're right. And can you tell us like, because you guys, what you are doing it

is like a very creative thing. It is not like, you know, in sometimes in development, you guys can just, you know, open your laptop. You know that you have to build this thing, so there is like some technical aspect involved, like, but not much of creativity, if I be honest. Maybe like a lot of back-end and front-end developers might not like me saying this. I am also like this full-stack development, but like, but if you are developing a design, even if you are creating a WordPress website, like, you have to think differently when you're back-end application. You know, just have to, this is the user data. You will just save in the database. There can be other difficult things, like, but it is user, and users are not seeing it. You are, you have a data model, or you have like snowflake or data migration, a lot of complex things going on on the back-end side. But when you are working on the design side, obviously, directly, client is seeing that part. So, how do you guys make sure that all your team, like, if you have like five

six members, all of them are creative and making something, you know, unique or new or intriguing for the clients rather than just, you know, making something very basic and boring. So, I was just, I would just say that, like this, there shouldn't be any gatekeeping involved. Like, design is what design is, a probable solution to any given problem, and a design-led approach is not just, I would say, it's not just for a designer; it can be for a developer, a tester, a manager, or anyone in a team where they can sit and say, Okay, this is the problem that I have at hand. Maybe it's how to manage this better or how to manage the spin better or how to test this better or how to develop this better. So, they can just take a moment, instead think upon it again, diverge, and say, How many ways can I do it? and then it will converge into one possible search, and I guess if I go this way, then I can solve a problem. So, this is something that we tried, that we tried in our

organization that will say okay that even if it's a designer job, and we are not saying that the developers have to design, even you just have to go about it as a process which ensures better outcomes. And like a good example for that in what we call in our organization is that there is no design handoff. So as in InDesign, there's this, I would say, this misconception, okay, that you have to prepare a design handoff, you hand it off, and then your work is done. And I just say that it can't be like that ever. Then the design handoff is also a process, just not a deliverable, okay? This is done. Yeah, you have to collaborate with a developer to ensure that this is the experience that you want to ship, that this experience that you want to ship to the stakeholders. And this involves collaboration. This is just, this is not just possible in this way that you can, you send a link of the figma or any XYZ to the developer and say, okay, now it's your job to do.

whatever you want to do with that. I think this is a little bit of how we can or anybody can contribute to being creative for that matter. Yeah, you're right. I would say like because I have seen some great design managers and they used to, you know, like sit with the front-end team and when they're designing, they used to say, you know, because sometimes there are some technical difficulties as well, that design is not, you know, you cannot print, and guys are like, you know, this is like very complex, we cannot do it. So, if you have like this design guy with you, he can say, you know, just like skip it, just add this, or like, you can, this thing is not looking good, we can just change it. So, your point is very valid, and it shows that your experience, and you have done this work for quite some time, because people think, you know, just we get the design, we ship it to front-end, our work is finished, and we work on some new feature, X feature, but it is not like that. It is the design.

person's responsibility to collaborate with the front-end team again, back and forth, and check how things are developing. Once it is shaped out, then you can work on some new features. Just to add on top of that, I think some multi-domain knowledge is necessary for a designer because I really think that my front-end development experience has helped me a lot in coming up with designs that are possible and quick in development for the developer. Because I know, okay, this is how it's going to be developed, and this is the way they can approach it, and they can come up with it in the timeline that we have. Otherwise, then I can come up with a design that is approved, and when the developers see the Prototype, it blows their head off like, Okay, how do I develop this in the amount of time that I have? This is just impossible. So, that's why being involved earlier in the process or at least having some kind of domain knowledge for front-end development for a designer can lead to

things becoming easier for the whole team. All in all, yeah, this is a very valid point. I would recommend, like, if you are a graphic designer, UI/UX expert, or like you want to become one, first, like, understand that part and then also, like, the basics of HTML, CSS. That, like, you know that if a guy needs to, like, map that Adobe XD to or Figma to HTML, that person can use this tag and can do it, like, using this. It's not like you are like, Okay, I designed something. It's not my headache how that person. Then there's a lot of problems in Clash going on because the front-end developers. I have seen in real life as well, like, sometimes they get, like, very difficult, like, design, and they are, you know, they are so stressed out, and they're thinking, like, We cannot do this. So, it's not a good situation. Yeah, yeah, it's not. It shouldn't be. I just think it shouldn't be a designer's mentality to just do great work for their own soul.

like okay, this is something I did great, but the impact of it is not what it's supposed to be. And if it's not contributing to the success of the product, then what are you solving as a designer? Yeah, you're right. And can you tell the tools that a designer should learn, like for someone who is listening to this podcast and that person does not know much about designing, but that person is inclined towards it. So what will be the roadmap that you should learn these two, three, five tools or do these certifications or courses? So what is your take on that? In theory, I think design theory has a lot of importance. So you know what you're going to do. That's like the base of it all, like the absolute base of it all, the first building block. And for Theory, I would recommend that if you have like, there are some great channels on YouTube, and you can show YouTube for all the free resources. But what I personally incline on in theory is the interaction design Foundation. The interaction design condition has been

great in contributing to my theoretical knowledge and for practical knowledge. You go anywhere you go to YouTube, you learn. I think the essential tools, if you want to just have a know-how of how to navigate your way around a certain tool. So, you go to YouTube for that. You can, I think, Figma, which is very famously used in UX right now because of its easy collaboration and for easier asset designing or vector designing. You can go for Illustrator, just saying, staying in the domain of experience design, not going towards graphic design or something. And for testing, you can. There are a lot of tools which I'm forgetting the name of one tool at the top of my head, but there are like, there's just one Google search away from a very easy tool which you can utilize for A/B testing or then the most like the direct way you can go to what is scheduling in a meeting or interview, and you can do it on even utilizing a Figma or Miro or any tool along that matter. So, if you know your

way around a Figma illustrator and Figma illustrator for that matter. You can come up with assets and experiences which you can join together to build a good experience for that matter. But even for that, you would need the theoretical knowledge of design and its principles just so you would understand that why you are utilizing this tool and what your goal is when you're using the store. So, a designer is definitely dependent on the tool they use, but like not entirely. So, you must have seen when Sigma recently got acquired by Adobe, there was a lot of like um statements in a design community. Okay, now it's going to get rubbish or it's going to, you know, it won't be that usable now. So then I have my mentor who told me that okay, whatever is happening in a design tool is not going to limit your ability as a designer. And that's the kind of designer you should be. And I took it to heart and I was like okay, whatever the tool is, the tool is just for my ease. If there's no

tour. I can still design experience, and I can still explain to the relevant people, stakeholders, okay, this is how I seen it should be better, and I can, and it should be able to do it without tool, but there are tools, so you should use them either. So, I would say like to sum up your what the tools and Technology. I would say like to design like because you use some difficult terms like vectors. So, for a limit, basically means like you want like in the you can say application. If there's like a graphic design, you see like a design on the lap doing something or a rocket flying. It can be a gif or it can be in just a static image. So, we call it like design guys call it a vector image, and illustrator design that Vector images. That's why I said didn't mention about Photoshop because Photoshop is not that much cure in doing this like creating you know Vector images, and there is like some limitations to it. It also have, I would say, ability to create things.

like, but I also don't like to design like, uh, that Vector good quality Vector images and export in XV SVG. So then I would recommend like, uh, Illustrator. And then whatever you have like, uh, the small objects, small images in Rob XD. And I would say Figma, both of them, like I would say like, are setting Adobe XD. Uh, also think that even Adobe has removed it from their website now because I remember back in the days like a lot of people used Rob XD. And then yeah, a lot of people use Figma. And then like, okay, it's merged now. That is great. And then like whatever Vector images and small images you have, you put on Figma, you create like a template, sort of template for it. You have like two, three template images, and then you copy-paste on every image. You can use some common, uh, you can say objects and things, and you design the whole experience. You can also add interactions to it. I think, uh, I said you can verify, you definitely can. So just in, in like if we want to cut

those three sure coming up with the assets. You can do it on Illustrator, then can you export those assets in Figma, and then you have the layout, whatever you are making, as in a desktop, or in a while you throw it on there. You're putting tests on Figma, and you're prototyping on Figma, and then you can definitely make. Why I didn't mention Photoshop is just because it's more towards photo editing, and if you need to edit photos, even when you're designing a film, which should go ahead, use Photoshop. Why not? Yeah, and Figma, like I have seen, when the whole experience is designed in Figma, it's very good. Like, even if you have to pitch your product to someone, and you have the whole journey map on Figma, you can just give. There's a link, right? You just give the link to the person. They will just click, click, click. It will show, you know, user will come on this. It's go to this page, and it is very

good like before even before like you know creating something like writing HTML for it like the end customer can see the whole journey. Obviously, there is no like dynamic data database is attached, but like the whole journey is like very easy, very smooth, but runs are working. You can add interactions and yeah, if clients uh like it or there's a good feedback, then you can just start working on development because previously I remember like five six years ago, like seven eight years ago. I remember like people used to build something and this happened with me as well. We used to build something, it takes a lot of time, and then we give it to the client. Client say, Oh, this is not good. Then we again have to do rebuild it and then again send it. But now this part is, I would say, pretty much cut because of the design guys. I totally agree. I totally agree. And even, and even I think today the value of prototype design, prototypes is highly, highly underrated. We raised, we raise funds for a stakeholder just using design prototypes. So they made the investor

understand that. Okay, this is how you're going to generate thousands of NFTs by, you know, 1K. Yeah, when the visualization is there in front of them, that's all they, that's all they're looking for. Okay, this is them, and then they ask questions related to the technical side of it, and if you're able to answer it, it is enough for them. Yeah, so the visualization, if their destination is there, then you can, you can go ahead and start building, and then you have that, that kind of feedback. Yeah, that is, that is crazy. Just by design, uh, that means like that design is like very good, and like the way you explain it, so hats off to you guys. And like, uh, the next thing I want to know, like, because you know, like now everyone is talking about AI, even in the development aspect. I work a lot on like development, cloud, and all of that stuff. So like, um, plugins, you know, we have GitHub Copilot. You start typing the code, and it knows like what you are doing. You just press

Tab It Auto completes your function. You can just give the prompt at the top, just add a code comment like it's a good approach. Whenever you write a function, just add a prompt. It will auto write the function for you, right? Similarly, power and stuff. So, how things are evolving on the design side, how tools like Figma or like other tools, even I don't know, are including AI and how you can incorporate that in your design thinking process and all of that. Figma does offer plugins, which we utilize heavily. And there is also a Chat GPT plugin. And there are also generative AI plugins. And there are also generative AI applications which can generate whole interfaces. But in my humble opinion, I can say that those generated interfaces are great, you know, for coming up with the mood board, this is coming up with the visualization of the application. But if you are working with a specialized target audience, I don't really know how that AI-built interface is going to perform. And you might have to do some

additional effort in testing it, but yeah, but I think if I haven't utilized it right now, but if I'm going to utilize it, I'm definitely going to utilize this for, you know, getting inspiration or to hire how we can make it visually better and the experience more folder. Yeah, I get it, like there's a lot of things going on, definitely. Yeah, this is also a good approach, like I from your answer, I get, you know, like rather than using that as a final, like design, um, and everything, you just get it, like you are like starting to design something for like a new client, you just give the prompt or something, you get that design, you just kind of see like, okay, these two, three things are good, these are not good, because usually AI response is like very generic, so maybe if you use it as it is, maybe there can be guess someone else is using it, and that can also be a case, so you just get the inspiration for it and might use few things and then just do that yourself, so yeah, that is important for someone who

does not know about it and thinking about okay because now there are like a lot of ads I would say on social media that um just give one prompt and you can generate posters. You can generate this. A lot of people also ask me you know for your YouTube uh thumbnails and your blog post thumbnails. Do you use like this tool? Do you use this AI tool? And uh there's a lot of talk. I tell them like I say like I've used a lot of them but like none of them work for me. They are like the images that what I want and what they give me. There's like a huge difference. So yeah I think it is still like we're still like a bit early to talk about this like after two three years maybe like things are different. Definitely like I'm I I'm really I'm really hopeful for it but until then we can use a tool in its capacity of being a tool only not a whole person who can do that exact job for you. Then the tool is supposed to just help.

you complete that job, and you can definitely utilize any of the AIs out there to make a job easier. Yeah, and what do you see about the future of this design industry? Where it is going, it is booming, or like it's going down, or like what's the future of it? Yeah, I would say that the difference you should have called me an expert on this. What is a lot of them, but I would. I'd really don't consider myself an expert at all. I still have to learn a lot. I mean, it's all thanks to my mentors that I have excelled in this. But if I see it going, it's in a direction where most of the designers will be focused on generating ways to generate value for the business and researching along their side, and then the visual coming up with the visual side of things might not be as difficult anymore. See, as we suggest in Think that the generator when coming up with interfaces which can generate The Experience utilizing the certain set.

of requirements and research that you have. So, if it has that kind of data, then it can, it might be able to do a better job in the near future. Yeah, you're right. Like, I think like in the future, like right now as well, like it has evolved a lot. Like previously, it was just about creating design. Now again, like people started creating the UX. Previously, there was no UX aspect. Like I remember like just images, images, then like the UX added this thing added in the market. Now you're also right. Like now it is all about, you know, understanding different businesses, how different businesses work, how SaaS platforms work, how like corporate businesses work, how automation works, and stuff. If you have that knowledge, like of like understanding of how like business works, how business actually generates money, how you can incorporate your solution, like this is more of like, I would say like designer job nowadays, right? You have to understand that and then create something, the whole experience based on that. Yeah, I think, I think a very radical change.

is possible, and in the way that we experience applications, in the way that we use it, and definitely that we would be looking forward, you know, to a designer to come up with that and to think daily out of the box to come up with something that everyone would say, Okay, yeah, this is actually better in, you know, how to interact with applications now. So, I think that is definitely possible. Yeah, that is good. And my last question is like, what is your advice for someone, like, you know, who wants to start their career in this design industry? I would say UI/UX or like all of that. So, what is your final advice? What they should know is that the tool is only as good as the designer, so you should focus on your capability, on the knowledge you have with the designer, and the ways to utilize this knowledge, and then the tool will be more useful for you. Yeah, that is a great, I would say, thing that you have said, like a great expression, I would say, because like it

is not about the tool. It is about the designer. It is about your thoughts, what you are thinking, rather than relying on tools and thinking that tools are doing everything. So yeah, that brings us to the end of another exciting podcast. And in this podcast, we discussed the design thinking process. We also discussed the MVP approach, SaaS platforms, and getting funding, and even getting findings before generating the platform, just on the design as well. This is crazy. And so yeah, it is a very exciting episode. So thank you, Asset, for joining in and sharing your expert insight on all the design thinking process and all of that. So yeah, it has been a great talk, I would say. Thank you so much for having me here. It has been an absolute pleasure and more of an honor to be here. It was amazing. Thank you so much. Thank you.

Design Thinking Process - MVP For Startups | Podcast with Asad #9

Design Thinking Process - MVP For Startups | Podcast with Asad #9