Way wherever you are, where that land meets the ocean, there is an underwater cable there, beneath the waves, that

connects you to the rest of the world. And it is these cables—they're about the size of a garden hose in most cases—that

carry 95% of the world's digital data: phone calls, emails, you name it. It's not satellites, it's not wireless magic; it is

this stuff on your screen, a massive network that physically lashes together the continents of Earth and spans nearly a million miles in the process. And

here's the concerning part: these cables can break, just like cables on land. Sometimes it's just an act of nature—a curious shark—but increasingly, it is also clear that sabotage is a possibility.

Chinese vessels have at least twice severed undersea cables in the Baltic Sea in Europe, including just last month when a

Chinese-owned ship, coming from a Russian port, dragged its anchor across the ocean floor for more than 100 miles. The

result: broken cables affecting at least four different countries. Now, the Chinese government says it supports the security of undersea cables, and the Russians have

forcefully denied any culpability here. However, the German defense minister said bluntly, "No one believes that these

cables were cut accidentally." Or, as NATO's former Supreme Commander for Europe put it earlier this year, "The age

of seabed warfare has arrived." So, how serious is all of this, and what is being done to stop it? Joining us now is Chris

Krebs, who was the first director of the U.S. Cybersecurity and Infrastructure Security Agency. Chris, welcome. Uh, the

reporting on this is wild. There's a whole world on the high seas that we just don't know about. Um, but but let's

talk about uh this this ship, this Chinese ship, uh that left a Russian port and cut the cables in Swedish waters, uh

European investigators say there's no way anyone manning a ship like this would not notice that its anchor was

down. It slowed down for days. What do you think is going on, and what's the threat? In fact, I think it doubled back at

one point. So, uh, look, just to make sure, maybe, yeah, you know, just to, to extra measure—measure twice, cut once—maybe

they were going to cut twice here. Look, I—so, subsea cables are a thing that have been, you know, a modern infrastructure

we'll call it, for about 150 years now. 1850, really. That's 1850 was the first

telegraph laid between, uh, England and France. And then fast forward to World War I, where the British fleet, uh,

controlled most of the actual submarine cable tenders—the ships that actually, uh, lay and repair cables—but they cut the

German cables, and the Germans couldn't fix it. So, modern warfare has included disrupting these seaborne cables for

for years and years. Even the US, in the Cold War, would tap into submarine cables that the Soviets had laid, and we

conducted espionage. We could listen in, uh, to their military communications. So it's been here, it's been

here, but now what's at stake, as Tony as you pointed out, the vast majority of global data transits these cables, and it

can lead to latency issues when there's damage, and in some cases, particularly geographically isolated countries, yeah, can have serious degradations, if not

total outages. Well, Taiwan comes to mind, right? Connected to the mainland by these cables, uh, if they're cut and a war

breaks out, I mean, you've got blank cell phone screens; maybe your equipment militarily struggles to to

work. Yeah, look, in—in the Chinese manufacture about, uh, anywhere from 30 to 50% of submarine cables that are

being laid now. They have a Tinder Fleet that represents about a quarter of the global, uh, ships. Uh, so they they've got

the capability to lay their own, but they also have the capabilities to go in and disrupt, to your point, Taiwan. And if

there is an invasion of Taiwan, you know, one of the first things to get hit is the cables. So what would be the potential

motivation if the German defense minister is right that it was not an accident that these cables were cut? That's

a good question, right? I think it's still early in the investigation to really figure out why there are

allegations that maybe the Russians influenced this, uh, ship captain, which might actually make sense. Which is

why the Chinese are actually cooperating. Why would that make sense? Well, because the Chinese are cooperating. Usually, if the Chinese are responsible for

something, they don't cooperate. Their statement was very kind of like, "We respect all international law and all of"

that." Where the Russians were more direct in their denial. Hold on, why why do we even need cables in this day and age? I

mean, CBS deals is selling you a wireless charging all the time, right? I mean, can we do wireless internet globally? Well,

it's it's about latency, it's about speed, and it's about capacity. So these cables can carry terabytes of data

equivalent to a satellite that can only do about a gigabyte in the same timeframe. So it's all about throughput, it's

about speed, it's about latency. What do we care about right now? How fast that Netflix movie or whatever, you know, look,

I'm in the middle of land, man. I can't wait to get home and, you know, we watched

Yellowstone the other night, but there's so much good stuff that's streaming, and the demand from the consumer is driving

More and more of this... This is how World War II is going to break out because the streaming is breaking. Exactly. If you

want to disrupt a country and sow chaos, cut the cable. That's it. Fire up the engines.

Uh, Chris, great to see you. Thank you very much for being here. I appreciate it.

Undersea internet cables face new threats

Each weekday morning, "CBS Mornings” co-hosts Gayle King, Tony Dokoupil and Nate Burleson bring you the latest breaking news, smart conversation and in-depth feature reporting. Watch "CBS Mornings" on weekdays at 7 a.m. ET on CBS and stream it at 8 a.m. ET on the CBS News app.

For licensing inquiries, contact: licensing@veritone.com


Undersea internet cables face new threats

Scripts