Challenges of Running Tier 17 Maps in Path of Exile 3.25

Tier 17s are too hard and expensive, lacking fun in trade League and affecting the community.

### Reddit's Concerns with Path of Exile Tier 17 Maps
* 💼  Tier 17 Maps are **Too Challenging and Unrewarding** for Many Builds.
* 🔄  Rolling Tier 17 Maps is Tedious and Requires **Specific Builds** to **Ignore Mods**.
* 💰  In Trade League, Players Feel Compelled to Farm **Tier 17s** for **Optimal Returns**.
* 🏆  Tier 17s Are the **Hardest and Most Rewarding** Content in the Game
* 🛡️  Many Mods Feel Punishing and Disable Builds Rather Than **Challenging Them**.
* 🧠  Some Reddit Posts Exaggerate Issues, Claiming "**Unavoidable Deaths**" and "**Scarab Dependency**".
* 🔮  Tier 17s Were Intended to **Bridge the Gap Between Normal and Uber Bosses**, but Feel More Like **Endgame Content**.
* 🎯  The Community Hopes for **Balancing Changes** to Make Tier 17s **More Enjoyable and Accessible**.

and tier 17s are too hard. Scarabs are too expensive, and they feel stuck. Ultimately, the only thing that matters to me is that I do not have fun running them in trade League. It feels like you have to farm tier 17s, the hottest topic on Reddit, and right now the biggest stressor on the community. I've taken the sentiment of most of the posts on the subreddit talking about tier 17s and what I've been hearing in my community and from others, and I've generalized most of the problems people are having and what I think the three main problems are to give some concise and short feedback to GGG. Even though it'll be a long video, I'll try to frontload most of the issues. At the start, we're going to talk about what I think the three main problems are, and we're going to discuss the aspects of tier 17s that I think the community is having and how to solve some of those problems, at least in the now, but also so what problems I

don't think really need to be solved, and what are sometimes more so just a bit of a player skill issue. All right, my three main problems with tier 17s, obviously number one is very easy. I think everybody, you know, would agree with this. It's not very much a hot TI rolling them is too annoying for most builds, and you're almost choosing a build just so that you don't have to roll so much. Strong builds are in the game, and there's strong builds of Plenty, but there are mods that many builds just cannot do. That means that you're going to have many, many map rerolls versus hex blast just taking whatever it comes. Hex blast just run these unidentified. It does not matter. Last League start on like day two, every hex Blaster could just run them even before we were chaos orbing them, even without identifying them. They were able to just walk in and ignore literally every single mod, which feels kind of crappy. It feels less about build strength with all of these map mods and rrolling them and more about

off-screen damage and ignoring every single map mod, which I guess is a little bit of a strength, but feels kind of cheap when that strength of ignoring every map mod is kind of relegated to very specific build archetypes, especially when this isn't really a specific Farm like sanctum and more so the in general new way to Farm in the end game. Problem number two in trade League, it feels like you have to farm these with increased effect, making the mod pool even stricter, again pushing everybody down into a much more narrow funnel of what builds you can feasibly play. Uh, trade players, we're DG, okay, we are absolute degenerates, we are wrapping Our Little Willie in aluminum foil and sticking it in that socket if it's an optimal farm, right? If we're printing the most of Vines an hour, it does not matter, we will stick with it, we will Farm it and we will hate it, but we will do it if it gives a ton of divs. And number three, they just feel too rewarding with the Scarab and the

currency nodes plus all of your increase effect plus you know some new chisels and the extra map slot. With the scarabs, it feels like you're being forced into eventually running them for a lot of content. I think the dropping of more maps that feels kind of fun. You can do it for a bunch of eight mods, and that doesn't really feel too imbalanced, right? You just get a bunch of eight mod maps to drop, and you can kind of farm your own eight mods without having to go to someone else. I like that, like that. I feel like that's kind of in a knife's spot, right? But with currency and scarabs, it does feel a little bit busted. Plus, with how juicy how many Monsters the total loot you can obtain from these Maps, it feels a little bit too far ahead of tier 16s. Little bit of balancing and maybe some reduction in power of the first two points make this feel a little bit more fair, but it just feels too big a step up from tier 16s with how much

currency, how much Scarab, how many monsters, and how much in total you can get out of the map, even excluding just the Uber boss fragments. All right, so now we're going to get into kind of how Reddit feels, my kind of like notes on this to keep it a little bit concise but but really there is kind of a lot of feelings and sentiment and things to discuss when it comes to tier 17s. Now this will all be in the context of farming with increased effect on your Maps, so a tree sort of like this where you grab every single increased effect node, grab the one per quality, grab this per explicit, grab all of these, and every single small node that you possibly can get all the increase effect that you possibly can and make them as juicy as possible because that will scale how many scarabs you get, how much currency you get, how many packs there are right, and then you roll them to be very juicy as well and so here 17s feel like they require you to eventually exclusively

Farm them now. This has some truth to it. It's not entirely true. You could 100% make a lot of currency outside of tier 17s, and with some Farms, you might even be making pretty darn close to what you get in t7s. And it could be a lot more fun for you. But if you're going through every meta farm and you're running them all the way through, and eventually you kind of want to experience something new and have it be one of those super high-profit Farms, well, you will be put into that funnel down into the tier 17s. And then you'll have to be rolling and figuring it all out with all the issues involved than that. So it does feel kind of forced eventually. And not to say that they are the only place to make currency. Okay, I will have a video discussing that sentiment, right? Because that is absolutely not the case. Scarabs are not priced for this, but that is for another video entirely. Scarabs are not exclusively priced for tier 17s there.

are still high-profit farms and fun ones even with scarabs in t16 maps. But eventually, you're going to run through them, and you will be pushed to tier 17 to experience new farms that are still very good. A lot of people don't like the layouts. Personally, I don't really feel like they're really that bad, you know. It's kind of more closed quarters. You've got some tunnels, some lanes, some, you know, rooms opening up. There could be a little backtracking. The only one I really don't like is kind of abomination. I feel like that one is kind of really annoying but doesn't feel like that bad, you know. I don't really feel like I'm in like a dungeon kind of layout right like Forbidden Woods, you know, like these are ones where it's like, oh man, you know, it's very frustrating to kind of run that kind of maze right. Like some of these are just like really, really annoying to run, and it doesn't really feel like that. They feel much more toned.

down you know like ball pyramids is very annoying uh and you know I don't really get that vibe that much plus like some of them have like a pretty decent layout like Fortress I I've been farming Fortress I I kind of like the Fortress layout you know it's not so bad they are very huge though right and then you get a lot more monsters the next point is like we discussed before the crappy mods with the increase effect makes many mods impossible to deal with for most of the builds that we're playing and it makes Rolling them become a chore that requires many rexes and I feel like this is one of the more important feedbacks to be giving that for train League you have to run with all the increased effect on the tree which is like 86 % increased effect now that we can chisel them and take advantage of that extra chisel effect and so there are so many mods that become instant bricks to too many builds without increase effects they would be much more reasonable still

crazy, but much, much more reasonable, right? We have like 100 AOE, this becoming 1086, you know, like that is kind of nuts. You know, 195 is as extra damage of a random element. That's a pretty brutal mod. Now, increase it by 86% alongside all the other ones, and it becomes absolutely bananas. This 50% chance to avoid poison could be doable on a poison build until you increase it by 86%, and now you have something like 90 whatever chance to avoid poison. And I think it could be fine to just have, you know, mods that are like, okay, it's a brick, but it seems like there's just too many of those mods, right? 50 less area of effect if you have AOE and you're farming these in trade League, you can't take that mod. Less recovery rate if you rely on recovering your life and your energy Shield at all, you can't take this mod. If you rely on Buffs on your character, you can't take Buffs expire faster. And so a build like

this you know this is a little niche. I could I could be sympathetic towards that one, but you know all of them combined right? Like with this one sure, like my ancest cry giving me my resistances and my Max RS expiring faster like that's a little bit Niche sure U, but it seems like when we're talking like right, the 80% recovery rate uh that comes on t7s or the 60% even with all the increase effect the less area of effect the mods like players have 50 less defense getting scaled by 86% increase effect meaning you have absolutely no armor, no evasion, and no energy Shield. There are so so many mods like this just for this build, and I don't think this is too unreasonable. These are all of the mods that I not only just refuse to run because they're very annoying, but they like they brick players and their minions deal no damage for four out of every 10 seconds. You're just never going to run this mod right like having to wait for 4 seconds to

start dealing damage to anything like this is just crazy reflect. Of course, I can't do reflect volatile cores. You're almost never going to be able to tank these, especially in maps with increased effect. They get like life or whatever on them, right? These are all so juicy B cores. Sure, it's softcore. I could run that, right? This is a mod I could run. It's... I've done it. It's really annoying. I can get randomly insta-G, sure. Okay, Fizz is extra chaos. This one is just specific to my build. I can't get too much chaos res, or I'm not Savage hitting with the Forbidden, right? So, you know, it is what it is. Player Marked for Death. If I kill a rare monster, I can't recover my life for 10 seconds, like right? Rare and unique monsters remove, and this is 10% life, mana, and energy Shield on hit. So, every single hit becomes a minimum 10% life, mana, and energy Shield. Like, this is just bananas. Union of Souls minus maximum resistances.

with 86 increase effect, this becomes just way too much to handle. You know, without the increase effect minus 10 Max, sure you know I'm at 90. I go to 80. That is a huge difference, okay, but going from minus 99 to like minus 16, minus whatever, you know, like what? It's just, it's too much. And you know, like minus Max, I get it. I could roll over that. Mod can't be leeched, less AOE, uh, cannot gain any charges, less defenses, less recovery rate, buffs expire faster, damage pen reduced, action speed if you're using skills quick, right? Like if you're using more than like one skill every whatever seconds, this is crazy. Again, reflect minus Max, again, no regen, less recovery, can't leech, Fizz is extra. This is just the normal map mods with chaos and wither. Buffs expire faster, less cooldown recovery rate, the AOE mod again. Like there are so many mods where I am just sitting here and it's not just rolling to not have these mods because

you've added extra scarabs, currency, or Maps. I have to roll these to be fine with all of the mods, and that they have not just the Scarab roll at 50 or 70, but that they have the Scarab roll at 110, 115, sometimes even more cuz remember, all right, we're wrapping it with aluminum foil, okay, you, we are made to do this, you are making me do this, like I said without increase effect. A lot of these become a little more reasonable, right, like 50 less defense if you're just armor, not evasion, not yes, I might be able to take 50 less defense hit. It's huge, it's brutal, but it's much more reasonable to deal with than 90 like 97% less defenses, right, like there is a world of difference between having half my armor and having all of my armor removed. This is the hardest content in the game. There should be some barrier to entry, but the barrier feels less about the gear or the skill and more about just playing hex blast mines or whatever can ignore most of the mods or off.

screen and not deal with whatever and one shot everything. On the one hand, it is kind of neat to be able to overcome a lot of these crappy mods. Solving curses on this build, I've got reduced effect of curses on a quicksilver. I've got consecrated ground with charges and charge reach full to have conch ground to also give me another 50 reduced effect of curses. I've got my Pantheon upgraded for the 30, and I've got this Mastery up here for the 20 reduce effect, so I always have 50 reduced if this flask is up. I'm immune to curses if this flask is up. I'm immune to curses, you know, this was pretty cute, and it gives me some way to, you know, feel like I'm mitigating some of those bad map mods. Same with the 30 reduced extra damage from crits from this node combined with the armor Mastery and a corruption on my shield, so I'm taking 88 reduced extra damage from crits. That's really nice cuz

now the crit Maps aren't chunking me as much especially if I'm giving them crit and power charges or whatever. It is having enough mitigation having enough recovery to survive all the random damage from all the increased physical as extra damage and whatever is going on in these Maps. But what it really comes down to is it just feels like I'm dodging every mod except curses crit speed charges fizzes extra and damage so most of these maps that I have it's just like I'm cursed with a bunch of stuff there's fizzes extra can't curse them and you know whatever other random stuff CSE with vulnerability fizzes extra uh you know like I've solved ailments so this is all fine meteor right curses damage can't crit them that's fine not my build suppress doesn't matter all of this stuff doesn't matter another curses unique bosses are possessed poison you know blah blah blah ailments like all of my Ms are just this crit charges boom CSE HSE no auras I lose damage meteor flask you know speed a OE and crit and

just keeps going. I just I I have so many Maps where I'm just like running with curses, and then whatever the hell like that's it feels like I'm just rolling for that. I'm just dodging all of these mods, and it just is a little bit tedious, and understand I could play, you know, hex blast mins or whatever, but you know, come on, man. I got a pretty juicy build, and I don't really feel like I'm unreasonably dodging too many mods, the only one being really like physic chaos, but that is kind of just in volatile cor, like I could just play better there, but it's just annoying, and I'd rather not run around puckered all the time. I have three rexes for Rolling these Maps. I have two of them for the t77 mods and one for the normal map mods, you know, things like less cool down recovery rate. I'm a cool down base build, uh, you know, triggering a bunch of Auto exerted war cries, triggering things out of Eternal Apple, so I need my Buffs to not expire.

too quickly. I need my cooldowns to not just be from 2.2 seconds on all my war cries to like four or whatever it would be. I need my area of effect because I'm Earth shatter. I need to have my armor because I have to mitigate physical damage. And then I need to not get penetrated and have like a bunch of minus Max and whatever, right? So, you know, it feels like I need to be recovering my life. It all feels like things that most builds are going to be doing but are forced to roll over to keep those. And it just feels a little bit cheesy. Now, I understand kind of a reason why they would want tier 17s to be rolled this often as I think I spend around maybe 16 to 20, maybe 25 chos rolling these Maps each. Man, it just feels like too much, right? When I'm doing red Maps, I don't mind rolling my red Maps. You know, they don't get too crazy and the eight mods I can kind of Rex.

them all in one, and it's not too bad. And Chaos sinks, you know, sure like to fight inflation. The economy is only ever generating items as a league goes on, but this doesn't feel like the way to do a chaos sync. If you want these maps to be the way for a chaos sync, I think it would be really nice to have some way to roll our Maps, right? Like maybe it could be in Kings March, we go to a guy, and you know, you upgrade something, and he can roll your maps for you, however many per, you know, for however many minutes, right? Uh, if I could set up all of my maps and log in to the morning, and they're all rolled without the mods that brick my build, that would be really, really neat, and it would alleviate a lot of these problems with the rolling of them, uh, not with the increased effect of them, right? Uh, but I feel like those kind of go hand in hand, like if we get rid of how they're run, how crazy the mods get, how

we scale them with increased effect of the mods. You know, we don't really need them to be rolled so much anymore. So, I'm not sure how they would tackle this problem if they're even going to. But you know, there's like so many ways to alleviate this pressure from tier 17s. Whether it's the increased effect of map mods, whether it's making them not feel so lucrative, having such crazy multipliers on how many scarabs, maps, and currency that you get for farming in them. I don't know what they're going to do, but it feels like they should be doing something. Now we get to my criticisms for Reddit and some of the things that I've kind of read on Reddit that I think are a little bit silly and are going a little overboard sometimes. And this is happening and again, this will be a video tomorrow. This is happening with people feeling like they're not getting currency, complaining about scar prices and the whole nine, but that also is like very overblown, um, but

just some things with t7s. there are problems with t7s 100%, but don't just give in, get very upset, and add like 15 extra things that aren't really problems on top. so some of the examples in Reddit posts, and I'm not talking about comments with 10 upvotes, I'm talking Reddit posts with like, you know, like 500, 700, 1500 upvotes with no pushback in the comments and with only agreement found, uh, in the comments until you get to like the three of vote comments. um, so things like petrification statues that permanently stun you when you roll with cast speed on the map. this isn't really like a problem, right? like there totally can be a combination of modifiers on tier 17s that could, you know, brick you. and I think purification statues combined with a bunch of cast speed, and I, I, I did frenzy charges, cast speed unique boss cast speed with all the effect, and I, I never encountered being Perma stun. now maybe I got, yeah, right, like you can get an unlucky timing or

whatever, right? Like, sure, I think that's fine, right? Like, this is not really something. This is not like, uh, a problem with tier 17s that needs to be addressed. It's like a funny that can happen when you're doing like the difficult content, okay, of drowning orbs. This is a quote from one of the most popular posts on the Reddit talking about tier 17s. Did you find yourself in the middle of a corridor blocked by Drowning orbs on both sides, just waiting to eventually die? I know I have. I have no idea what the hell this guy's talking about. I think the only way you're dying to Drowning orbs is if you have no movement ability and you have no instant like frost blink or something, right? Like, I did a drowning orb map. If you are just running and it's in like temp chains or something, sure, the orb will catch up with you, but I feel like that's more on you for not having any Mobility at all, no movement ability. Maybe if you are running like Mage blood.

Quicksilver Onslaught increased effect. Blah blah blah. And you have a bunch of move speed. It probably becomes a non-issue at that point. But until then, you probably should run like a Frost Blink, a Flame Dash, a Leap Slam, Whirling Blades, Shield Charge, something, right? Like, you should have a mobility option. Drowning orbs should not be an issue. It should be like, Man, you little, you know, like, let me pick up this loot. Don't make me, right? Like, don't make me jump out or whatever. Um, like the only, I did, drowning orb maps. The only time that I died to the drowning orb was I got stuck on some deli thing or whatever, uh, against a wall, right? And then I tried to LEAP slam to the top right, but I slammed against the wall like two times. Not a wall. There was like some, a thing in the middle of a fortress-like room, right? Like one of those opened up areas. There's like a thing in the middle, and I just, like, tried jumping a little bit to the side, uh, but it was too much up, so I

jumped into that thing like two times in a row, and then I, I don't have Frost blink on this build, so I didn't have like an instant out, and I was like okay, you know, like you got me. I leap slam into the wall twice instead of just like going back or going down, you know, I kind of try to do a cheeky up angle, and you know, it got me. It's like this is not really like an issue that needs to be solved. Like come on, you know, you can get like cheesed sometimes by like a random orb or something like the drowning orbs, you know, like Exarch runes. I feel like are such a larger issue, like all of that, but I don't know, like drowning orbs, like where you're being so dramatic. Like have you found yourself blocked on both sides, like there is no Escape if you have two drowning orbs coming to you, your only option is to die. Like this is it's just we are not in reality right now. Uh, another thing low

availability quote no way to farm them so you can permanently run them you have to buy them and use Discord. This is just not true. Now what is true is that you cannot permanently run them, and I don't think that's a problem at all. There's many things in this game we can't permanently run: log books, blights, forbidden TOS, the list goes on. Simulacrums. And then you have to buy them. That's called playing and trade League. Okay, but if you want to bulk buy tier 17 maps, it's as easy as going to the trade site, setting a Min stock count of 10, clicking chaos, and then just buying however many from whomever, right? It's super easy. You don't have to use Discord. We have a trade s, we have a bulk section. There's a ton of people with their eight, their tier 17 maps that you can buy from, just like you can with simulacrums, Deli orbs, blight Maps, the whole nine. This is just it's

very silly bosses are delete SL tank or die with little in between. I kind of agree with this a little bit. It really does feel like until you just get so wildly tanky or one-shot the boss that there is not much wiggle room. But that's only within the context of scaling increased effect on your maps and doing tier 17s without all the effect on the tree. A little bit of prep, just doing tier 17s for completion, is really not that hard. It's totally doable. I implore you to roll a tier 17 to not look so juicy. Make sure it doesn't brick any of the modifiers that will just like brick you in your build. Even without all the effect, get some triple ell flasks, roll domination tree, like get some shrines, pay for shrines on the map device, maybe put a couple extra shrines scarabs, the domination scares in your map device as well, and give it a try. It's going to be a lot easier, easier than you think it will, as long as

you have a decently set up build, right? Like, if you are doing t16s and not dying all the time, and you can kill the map boss pretty quick, I think you're going to have a much more surprisingly easy time than you would expect, unless you do the UTD map, okay? Unless you do Zigat, okay? Stay away from that UTD one. That guy's, uh, that guy's a little be. If you're going to do Abomination, make sure you kill Dodre last. Another complaint, you get a lot of gold from them compared to tier 16s. I mean, you kind of should, right? This is, we're talking about harder content, we're talking about the next step, we're talking about tier 17s, right? It's, it's the next step above t6s. Now, maybe they give like too much gold, right? They do give quite a bit of gold, but you know, even in tier 16s, you could just like blast t16s, and you're still getting like a decent amount of gold, right?

they're so much faster to run. I was doing, you know, whatever strategies for the last week in t16s and just getting like a ton of gold and running whatever. But the thing is, like, if you're spending a lot of your gold on things like disenchanting or mapping and stuff like that, like really all for me that I need my gold for right now is farming and then for doing these small little shipments. Like, mining doesn't really take up a lot of gold 'cause you know it kind of like goes by real quick. The smelting turns them into bars quick. They're not really doing much but it's really like these guys. And if you're doing map Runners, that's where a lot of gold gets eaten up, you know, like t7 sh, right? Like this, it feels a little silly to like, you know, they give so much gold like they do but I I feel like this is like the least, the least of the problems right now. Let's be concise, not just like add a bunch of things on Reddit feels.

like tier 16s suck, and tier 17s are too hard. Scarabs are too expensive, and they feel stuck. Uh, yeah, the Reddit feels a lot of ways right now. Some of these feelings aren't rooted in reality. Scarabs are not too expensive and are not priced for tier 17s. Now you can say scarabs feel expensive, and that's true. Scarabs do feel expensive, but are they too expensive to turn a profit? And that is a no. That is a big fat no, and we'll talk about that in tomorrow's video. The 17s are too hard though for a lot of builds, just with all the mods and how you have to farm them. We are forced into the increased effect Farms unless you're just spamming them for fragments, so they feel a little bit more stuck this league because you know they're kind of stuck. Now, this is a little bit more of a skill issue. This is one of the sentiments I hope can kind of combat and you know give some pointers to those who feel like

this to get them out of feeling like this, 'cause you shouldn't feel stuck in a t16 with scarabs being too expensive. Most of the strategies that use scarabs are turning you a profit again. That's kind of for tomorrow, even though I'm dabbling a little bit today. I thought this was a very good quote that kind of summarizes how Reddit is feeling about tier 17s. Ultimately, the only thing that matters to me is that I do not have fun running them, and I think that is a really big problem. They're not very fun at all to roll them for all the mods with all the rexes, and then for a lot of scarabs, a lot of the mods feel a little bit too punishing where you kind of really need to restrict how many things you're running by volatile cores. Don't feel like they are telegraphs so well, and for how much damage they do, it is a little bit silly, and it just is very uncomfortable to farm them until you have so much gear that every single

thing becomes trivialized, and I think it's okay to have content that is very difficult that pushes our builds, and that is overcome with a lot of gear, but it feels just not balanced enough right now because we have to run them with increased effect, which just makes it so absurd so quickly. It feels like there needs to be a little bit of a balance patch on these, or maybe some other ways to increase their difficulty through some scarabs or some mechanics or something. It just feels like it just feels absurd. It's just crazy. Okay, tier 17s were supposed to, on launch, accomplish two things: make normal boss drops remain compelling and bridge the gap between normal and Uber bosses. Now to me, it does feel like normal boss drops are kind of okay. It really sucks like Maven isn't very expensive on League start, so you are a little bit less incentivized towards Maven Splinter farming from things like invitations or just doing 10 boss spamming with that Keystone. But you know when I think about it and I look at

them. And I think about like how bosses and like other args is it really in a bad State like not really now that I think about it write it down and whatnot so like Maven gets awaken gems and belts. Thyrus gets threat of hopes that one's a little bit of a meme honestly eer and exarc get forbidden Jewels. Elder gets a watcher eye and an Uber fragment. Shaper gets a dying sun and an Uber fragment. Cortex gives bottle Faith all of these can drop orb of dominance as well and with most of these but you can get a spiky kind of big reward that's very exciting like you would with bosses and other games most of the time it's whatever whatever you're kind of just like farming you get whatever and then there can be a really exciting thing you might ID a really good Watcher eye or you just sell them all an ID you might get a really good awakened gem you might get a really good forbidden Jewel these are kind of like still exciting and

still compelling. There are still excitements in these bosses, although it's less about the actual gear that you get from them and more about the RNG kind of gamble that you can get from them. And I almost think that that feels kind of okay. There's still gear from these that you use on builds, but it's really like the Uber bosses that can give you some really neat stuff like Shaper with Echo of Creation and Tides of Time. Those are some really powerful pieces. And for Genesis from Maven, from Uber Maven, you know, it kind of makes sense that these are kind of gated to those Uber bosses. And I feel like, you know, they did kind of hit that. Now as a bridge from normal to Uber bosses, it feels much more true in SSF than in trade League just because of how valuable the Farms are, how valuable the maps are, and how we have to run them with increased effect. It does not feel like a bridge between Uber bosses and normal maps at all. Now you can still

just run these for fragments in trade League even and this still you know then it kind of does perform that function right just fragment farming. You run in Kill the Boss get whatever leave open another right you're not like scaling these with increase effect or you know whatever the hell uh you're just fragment farming and they are a lot easier this league than in last League very very easier so it is kind of like true but it's just because of how you farm that outside of just blasting for fragments that makes this feel like it's not a true and kind of like Nice Bridge to Ubers. And it seems like a third thing was added with tier 17s which they almost even explicitly said they did not want to happen and that was a new ceiling of mapping difficulty build stress testing and loot generation. This is now the hardest and most rewarding content in the game it's a large chaos sync and it requires much more gear to become pushover content or just playing a specific build and cheesing it like

hex blast throwing your minds all the way in front of you, and being able to ignore literally every single map mod, and I think it could be fine as a new ceiling, a new whatever, it just, yeah, I don't know. It feels like they need something, right? It doesn't feel good where they're at now, the rolling them, how the mods feel for most builds. Uh, it's not even how the mods feel for most builds, it's just how many mods have to be justly ignored, uh, and you know, it's really just like the mods and the rolling, right? Like if these and like how much you get out of them. Like if they gave a little bit less, were much less annoying to roll, and maybe didn't even scale with increased effect of map mods, like perhaps they have Baseline difficulties that are punishing but that don't become absurd with 86% increase effect, like if I lost a big chunk of AOE on this, if I lost a big chunk of armor, if I lost a big chunk of whatever it is.

I could cope with that. What I cannot cope with is losing all of my area of effect, losing all of my recovery, all of my armor, all of my evasion, and my energy shield. The not dealing damage every whatever seconds, almost losing all my debuffs like so much faster, losing all of my cooldown recovery rate. Any build that uses anything at all that has a CDR, it's just not doable, it's absurd. I would like it more to be punishing and less disabling, and I feel like that is kind of a core takeaway. I hope this was a little bit of a summary, kind of talking about tier 17s. It still felt very jumbled, all my thoughts, even though I kind of written them all down and talked through them. I hope some people found it valuable, hopefully, you know, t7s don't sound as scary. We kind of like just written down what the actual problems are, and you know, we're not talking about, you know, some random hyperbole of drowning orbs or, you know, whatever the

difficulty is like actually trying to get to the core problems here. And what can be changed what the problems actually are. How you might be able to avoid some of them. And again you know don't be afraid of t7s be afraid of t7s with a bunch of map mod effect and doing 20 of them in a row. If you're just doing one right with some shrines or whatever try it out right. I know they sell for a lot but try it out you'd be surprised as soon right. If you've got a character with a lot of T2 modifiers in every slot with eldrich implicits map bosses that you're fighting are dying relatively quickly. Or you are extremely tanky right like put the ell flas on grab a couple shrines and try it out right. You don't really need a carry this league without the increased effect and with a little bit of rolling and some flasks and shrines maybe a little cheese. They are much more reasonable much more doable anyways like And subscribe I'll see you.

guys, in the live stream. Hopefully, you enjoyed my thoughts on tier 17s and my summarization of Reddit's thoughts on tier 17s as well. Bye.

Reddit Is Wrong About T17s...

Tripolar Bear

The Overwhelming Issues with Tier 17s in the Trade League

Tier 17 maps are overly difficult to run for most builds, leading to constant and frustrating map rerolls.

In the trade league, there is a strong pressure to farm these maps with increased effect, which narrows down the feasible build options for players.

The rewards from Tier 17 maps, including scarabs and currency nodes, are so significant that they overshadow the benefits of running Tier 16 maps, creating a major imbalance in the endgame content.

The Impact of Tier 17 Farms in Path of Exile

Tier 17 farms can be highly profitable, but they may eventually feel forced due to their high-impact mods and layout frustrations.

The increased effect of mods in trade leagues makes many of them unreasonable for most builds, leading to a challenging and frustrating gaming experience.

The combination of mods in Tier 17 farms can significantly limit player options and even render some builds unviable.

Dealing with Challenging Map Mods in the Game

Players struggle with various challenging map mods that make it difficult to tank volatile cores, especially in maps with increased effect.

The excessive number of mods, including damage reflection, reduced resistances, and inability to recover life, mana, and energy shield, make it challenging to survive.

Despite the difficulty, players have found ways to overcome these mods through mitigation, recovery, and immunity strategies.

Frustration with Rolling Tier 17 Maps in Path of Exile

A player expresses frustration with the need to constantly roll Tier 17 maps to avoid modifiers that negatively impact their build.

They suggest the possibility of a map-rolling mechanic to alleviate this issue.

The player also criticizes exaggerated complaints on Reddit about Tier 17 map problems, arguing that some of the reported issues are not as severe as portrayed.

Addressing Concerns About Tier 17 Maps in Path of Exile

Drowning orbs in Tier 17 maps may not be a major issue if players have proper mobility abilities.

The claim of low availability and the need to use Discord to buy Tier 17 maps is refuted, as they are easily accessible through the in-game trade system.

While Tier 17 bosses may seem challenging, with the right preparation and strategy, completing these maps is achievable, even without maxed effect on the skill tree.

Tips for Tackling Tier 17 Maps in Path of Exile

T16s are much faster to run and still provide a decent amount of gold, making them a good alternative to T17s.

Scarabs may feel expensive, but they are not priced for T17s and can still turn a profit.

Many players find T17 maps to be too challenging and not enjoyable to run, especially with the punishing mods and volatile cores.

Need for Balance Patch in Tier 17 Content

The current Tier 17 content in the game is unbalanced, requiring increased effect to be feasible and trivializing the challenge.

It fails to effectively bridge the gap between normal and Uber bosses, especially in trade leagues.

The content has now become the hardest and most rewarding in the game, creating a significant gear requirement and stress testing for players.

Rethinking the Impact of Map Mods in Tier 17s

The current state of map mods in Tier 17s is problematic for many builds, causing them to have to ignore numerous mods.

The excessive scaling of map mods with increased effect makes it difficult for players to deal with the disabling effects while trying to maintain their build's functionality.

The suggestion is to make the map mods more punishing and less disabling to address the core problems and make Tier 17s more manageable for a wider range of builds.