Jewish Messianic Beliefs: The Two Messiahs Explained

Messiah son of Joseph and Messiah son of David are distinct figures in Jewish tradition, each fulfilling unique roles in redemption.

### The Complex Debate on Messianic Prophecies and Jewish Tradition
* 🔥 The discussion begins with a confrontation regarding the **forced conversion of Jews to Christianity** and the speaker's assertion that **rabbis are misleading the faithful**.
* 🤔 The speaker challenges the interpretation of Genesis 49:10, insisting that it does not **explicitly mention the Messiah**, and demands clarity on how this passage relates to the concept of **Shiloh**.
* 📜 A key point raised is the existence of two Messiahs in Jewish tradition: **Messiah Ben David**, from the tribe of Judah, and **Messiah Ben Joseph**, from the tribe of Ephraim, each with distinct roles in **ushering in the Messianic era**.
* 📖 The speaker references Isaiah 53 to illustrate the **suffering associated with Messiah Ben Joseph**, yet emphasizes that traditional interpretations may not directly label him as such.
* 🔍 The argument continues with the assertion that Zechariah 12:10, often cited in Messianic discussions, does not explicitly mention either Messiah but rather speaks of **God being pierced**.
* 🗣 The speaker highlights the pre-existence of Messiah Ben Joseph in Jewish texts, suggesting he **accepted the burden of Israel's sins**, thereby linking him to **suffering and redemption**.
* 📚 The complexity of these interpretations reveals **deep theological divides** and differing understandings of biblical prophecy, particularly regarding the **identities and roles of the Messiahs**.
* ⚖ Ultimately, the debate underscores the **tension between traditional Jewish beliefs and Messianic interpretations**, as each side defends its understanding of **scriptural texts**.

I do run a teaching in Spanish to bring back the benan. The descendants of the Jews were forced to convert to your religion, to Christianity. Yeah, bring them to Satanism. Your rabbis are burning in hell, so okay. May God save them from your rabbis who are burning in hell. May he save you from your blasphemy. So okay, so I tell you, okay, so I tell you quick. Obviously, you're really angry. I can see that. But okay, that's okay. No, not as angry as you. You just said, listen, don't appeal to sympathy like a narcissist. You're the one who just barked and said to bring back the Jews that my ancestors forced them to become Christians. So don't play the victim like a narcissist. Get to the topic, okay? The topic over see is Jesus the Messiah. I will tell you, he, according to your prophecy, is, and your rabbis are liars. Let me tell you, let me tell you, okay. According to the Bible, you got Genesis 49, verse 10. You got Isaiah 11 on.

Wait, no, take one out of time. How do you know Genesis 49 is about the Messiah? He talks about Judah. How do you know it's about the Messiah? Didn't ask you about Judah. I know about Judah. Judah, right? Let me repeat it again. Pretend you're listening to the question. Come down. Be he breathe. I know you're scared. The demons are pricking you. Listen. Genesis 49:8-12 about Shiloh. I know it better than your rabbis. Talks about the scepter will not depart from Judah. But how do you know it's about Messiah? Every this interpretation biblically. Say it again. That's interpretation of the Bible. So I want you to be clear. You assumed your interpretation. You didn't prove it. 'Cause if I read Genesis 49:8-12, it doesn't say son of David or Messiah. Correct those words. Okay, no. Admit it first. Yes, that is coming. That is referring to Messiah about Shiloh. The one's gonna be sent. Shiloh. Wait, wait. Who? Who Shiloh?

Okay, Sheilo, I know, but for the record, I want you to be slow. I'll barbecue you slowly. I know you're argu, just be patient. I'll let you see what answer first. Admit Genesis 49:8 to 12. Shiloh, you're assuming it's Messiah. I'm not saying you're right or wrong, but I want people to know you've already assumed your tradition. You're reading into it. So, can you at least be honest? The text itself, just the wording, no reference to Messiah or son of David, correct? Talks about the descendency of the Messi, even answer the question, correct? Judah, right? Correct? Is the promise of God to Judah that from here will come the septer? No, okay, but that can be David. But you're not answering me. Could you? Okay, let's start with David. Let's start with D. Let's start. Let's go here. Can you tell us about the rabbis and the two messiah, Messiah Ben Joseph? What happens to him? Fantastic. Thank you for telling me this. Fantas. Tell me what.

glory to God. Okay, glory to Jesus, the God of the rabbis who messiah's. Okay, so let me tell you because you just opened a different door that I wasn't. Can you answer the question? I will answer. Take it easy. Okay, mashia Ben David, Mah Joseph. I will tell you gota be m for you. Come on, mashia David comes from Judah, David, and shomo. That's mashia B David, and it's the L that's in second chronicles. Rabf is the one that comes from ephra, which is a parable, which is a parable. I'm you in a minute. Yeah, yeah, yeah. What prophecy speaks mhia Ben David, Ben ysep? Can you tell me? There is no prophecy according to your rabbis. Yes, no, no. Let me listen. You learn list. Stop barking, girl. What prophecy did rash? What propy? Wait, wait. What prophecy did Rashi use in reference to mashia Ben ysf? Okay, can I talk or you want to talk? Can you answer or you're going to

manifest I want to, but I that's not a quick answer. It's elate answer stopping go ahead Isaiah 53 Bobby habbi you gotta be nice. You're supposed to be. You're supposed to have the like Rabb get to the point mashia B ysep comes from a parable from the talmud, but it's a parable that talks about the Messiah Ben yoseph that comes from the tribe of Ephraim. So it has nothing and obiously they quote Isaiah 53 San 98 read the screen for me the Hebrew of Rashia read it read it right here am a man who Mourns for his own son. Yeah read the Hebrew read the Hebrew okay amand don't let me just tell you amand read the Hebrew body. You're wasting my time can you read the Hebrew Habibi Habibi you're wasting my time if you don't let me answer Habibi let me talk you don't read the Hebrew no I'm not going to read it for

you because you're not listening. Okay, I'm going to give you 10 seconds to read the Hebrew then English, and I'm going to get you out of it because you're barking. Can you read? Okay, do you're. I won't read it in Hebrew for you. Read it. I won't. Why are you so angry? You're so angry. Guys, shut up. The guy starts saying, I want to bring back. You can't bring that. You couldn't bring back a cockroach to your hellhole if your life depended on it. According to rabbis, how many Messiah will there be? Uh, one. No, see, they lie to you. There are two. There are two messiahs in the toet. Two Messiah. Yes, Messiah son of Joseph who will be killed in battle, and Messiah son of David who will resurrect him. Jewish tradition speaks of two redeemers, each one called messiah. Both are involved in ushering in the Messianic era. How many Messiahs? Two. They are mhia Ben David and mhia Ben ysep. The term mashia unqualified always refers to

mhia David, mashia, descendant of David of the tribe of Judah. He is in, he is the actual final Redeemer who shall rule in the Messianic age. All that was said in our text relates to him. Now scroll down mhia Ben ysep, mhia thec of Joseph of the tribe of Ephraim, son of Joseph, is also referred to as mashia benim mashia. He will come first before the final Redeemer and later will serve as his vice Roy. The essential task of mashia Ben ysf is to act as a precursor to mhia Ben David, he's G to come and prepare people for the of David. He will prepare the world for the coming of the final Redeemer. Different sources attribute to him different functions, some even charging him with tasks traditionally associated with mhia, meaning this Messiah son of Joseph. He does things that Messiah son of David does, such as the Gathering of the Exiles, the rebuilding of the B Mikes. He will rebuild the Temple, so the rabbis on the

other hand saw these references and concluded H. So there will be a reigning Messiah, that's the Davidic Messiah. But then the Messiah who suffers like Joseph did, but then will be exalted like Joseph was, then he's the Messiah son of Joseph, right? But there's nothing explicit. In other words, if you go to Zechariah 12:10, which the rabbis interpreted as referring to the Messiah in Zechariah 12:10, when it says, They shall look on me whom they pierced and mourn for him as one mourns for the death of an only son, right? They say, Oh, that's Messiah son of Joseph who'll be killed in the war of Gog and Magog, whom David, the son of David, the Messiah son of David, will resurrect. But it doesn't say Messiah son of Joseph. In fact, it doesn't even say Messiah. It says, They shall look on me whom they pierced. That's God speaking. The Jews will mourn over the fact that they pierced me, their God.

Messiah. The word messiah's not there, neither Messiah son of Joseph or Messiah son of David. It's God whom they're going to physically thrust through, right, and pierce to death, or pierce at least, right? Okay, that's what it says. But the rabbis read that saying, Oh, this one will be pierced through, slain in battle. That's Messiah son of Joseph, and Messiah son of David will resurrect him. Now, another name for messiah son of Joseph is Ephraim. He's called Ephra. Why? Because Ephra is Joseph's son. In the PTI, they're Messiah son of Joseph called Ephraim preexist. I did a session on this. There, we're told that the Messiah son of Joseph, Ephraim, is there with God from the days of creation. He's been there with God, and God tells him, Are you willing to bear the yoke of the sins of Israel so that they can be redeemed and they can be forgiven? And he accepts it. So, there you have in the P, which I quote, one of

my articles this session on it. The acknowledgement of the pre-existence of Messiah son of Joseph. It's in a Jewish source. It's there. I quote it in my article articles, and I did a session on it, right? And he's saying, saying, I will take this yoke, and it even quotes Psalm 22 and applies it to Messiah son of Joseph suffering vicariously for the sins of Israel.

Jewish Rabbi MALFUNCTIONS In Debate On Jesus Being The Messiah VS Sam Shamoun

TheArchive

The speaker is teaching in Spanish and expressing anger towards the forced conversion of Jews to Christianity.

They argue that the Bible, specifically Genesis 49:8-12, refers to the Messiah and challenge the interpretation of the verses.

The conversation becomes confrontational, with both parties accusing each other and defending their beliefs.

The conversation revolves around the interpretation of Genesis 49:8-12 and its connection to the Messiah.

There is a debate about the assumption of tradition and the wording of the text, specifically regarding the promise of God to Judah and the scepter.

The discussion also touches on the two Messiahs in rabbinic thought, Mashiach Ben Joseph and Mashiach Ben David, and the lack of a specific prophecy for Mashiach Ben Joseph according to the rabbis.

The Concept of Two Messiahs in Jewish Tradition

Jewish tradition teaches the existence of two Messiahs: Messiah son of Joseph, who is killed in battle, and Messiah son of David, who resurrects him.

The parable from the Talmud highlights the role of Messiah Ben Yoseph from the tribe of Ephraim.

Both Messiahs are involved in ushering in the Messianic era, with the term "mashia" unqualified referring to them.

The Role of the Messianic Figures in Jewish Tradition

Mhia David, from the tribe of Judah, is the final Redeemer who will rule in the Messianic age.

Mhia Ben Yosef, from the tribe of Ephraim, will come first as a precursor to Mhia Ben David and later serve as his vice Roy.

Both messianic figures are associated with similar tasks, such as gathering exiles and rebuilding the Temple, with the rabbis interpreting their roles as complementary in the Messianic prophecy.

The Concept of the Messiah in Jewish Tradition

The term "Messiah" is not explicitly mentioned, but the idea of a pierced and slain figure is associated with the Messiah son of Joseph and the Messiah son of David.

The Messiah son of Joseph, also called Ephraim, is believed to have preexisted with God since creation and accepted the yoke of Israel's sins for their redemption.

Jewish sources acknowledge the pre-existence of the Messiah son of Joseph and apply Psalm 22 to his vicarious suffering for the sins of Israel.