This year, the estimated deficit caused by foreign tourists using credit cards in Japan exceeds 30 billion yen. Why does it lead to a deficit for Japanese card companies when tourists use their cards in Japan? What impact does this have on consumers? We will explore these questions. Our guest today is Ms. Miya Yamaoka, the former director of the Payment Systems Department of the Bank of Japan and an expert in cashless payments, who is also the director of the Financial Research Institute. Thank you for joining us.

Thank you for having me. Now, let's first confirm why Japanese card companies incur losses when foreign tourists use credit cards in Japan. For instance, if a foreign tourist makes a payment of 10,000 yen at a shop or restaurant in Japan using a credit card issued in their home country, the credit card processing fee typically ranges from 1% to 3%, depending on the transaction volume. For this example, let's consider a large store with a fee of 1.99%. In this case, out of the 10,000 yen, 190 yen would be the revenue for the card company. However, the issue arises beyond this point. The card company...

Looking at Mr. Yamaoka, it seems that there are various fees that need to be paid. First, the domestic system operation cost is about 10 yen. Then, for overseas card issuing companies, there is an interchange fee, which is around 180 yen. Additionally, for international brands like Visa and MasterCard, the fee is 880 yen. This can be considered as a usage fee for the international payment infrastructure. When we sum all these amounts and compare it to the previous figure of 190 yen, we find that it results in a deficit of about 70 to 80 yen. This means that the more foreign visitors use their cards, the more the Japanese card companies accumulate losses. So, how did this situation come about? 

This is because the fees paid when using cards differ significantly between domestic users in Japan and foreign visitors. As a result, when foreigners use their cards, the fees involve international brands and interchange fees.

This will be quite expensive. However, Japanese credit card companies consider both parties in order to develop merchant networks. When used in Japan, they likely won't charge such high fees, resulting in a lower overall fee structure for merchants. Recently, however, the frequency of use by foreigners has increased more than expected, leading to an overall rise in deficits. 

In the first place, when Japanese people use credit cards in Japan, as you mentioned, the fees are not that high, correct? Yes, in Japan, many credit card companies handle both card issuance and merchant contracts. This is called a merchant acquiring transaction, and in this case, interchange fees do not occur. Even when these two functions are separated, the default rates of Japanese credit cards are significantly different from those overseas. Therefore, in comparison to Japan's interchange fees, the fees charged overseas are...

高めになります。うん、それから海外の方が使われる場合には、やはりビザカードですとかマスターカードに対してブランド使用量、これは国際的な決済インフラを使うことによって生じてくるものです。これを払わなければいけない。しかし、国内の方が国内で完結する取引をした場合には、海外経由の決済というのが発生しないので、そのインフラの手数料がかからないということになります。これらを足し合わせると、国内と海外の場合でかなりの手数料差が生じるということになります。うん、ここを安くすることというのはできないんでしょうか。

こちらはですね、ビザとかマスターカード、このインターチェンジフィーの体系というのは、これは標準の手数料率を公開しています。で、ほぼこの2つのブランドというのは非常に大きいということで、事実上これと違う手数料率を使うことは難しいというのが実態だと思います。うん、ここで外国人観光客の動向を確認していきましょう。今年は日本を訪れる外国人は3000万人を超えると見られ、これまで一番多かったコロナ前の

It is estimated that 31,318,188 people will be updated. As for the graph on the right, it is expected that the amount of money spent in Japan this year will reach a record high of 8 trillion yen. Mr. Yamaoka, what proportion of this 8 trillion yen spent by foreigners will be made using credit cards? 

Yes, I believe the majority will be through credit cards. According to statistics, as of 2020, the total usage of credit cards was about 75 trillion yen, with approximately 5% of that being international usage. Now, as this figure approaches 100 trillion yen, the rate of international usage is also expected to increase. This means that, through simple calculations, we could see about 5 trillion yen. Therefore, if we consider 5 trillion yen out of the 8 trillion yen, it is likely that a significant portion will indeed be made using credit cards. 

The 30 billion yen deficit projected for this year for Japanese card companies is based on the assumption that 60% of the 8 trillion yen spent by foreigners in Japan will be paid using credit cards. The Nikkei conducted a survey among major card companies that will bear this deficit.

Recently, we received responses from seven major companies. All seven companies reported that their losses have been widening. Furthermore, six of these companies are considering or have already implemented a system where the burden of losses will be shared with stores rather than being absorbed solely by the customers. They are examining or have introduced a two-tiered pricing model. Regarding the cause of these losses, all seven companies indicated that the high payment amounts to international brands such as Visa and MasterCard are a significant factor. Mr. Yamaoka, what are your thoughts on imposing this burden on the stores through a two-tiered pricing model? 

Yes, theoretically, a pricing structure that reflects costs in detail would be ideal. However, from the perspective of the stores, they cannot simply accept this. Japanese card companies have historically offered lower rates tailored to the Japanese market, understanding the differences in pricing structures. For the stores, this detailed pricing would effectively mean a price increase. I believe this will lead to tough negotiations with the card companies.

It seems that there is a high level of dependency on consumption among foreigners, particularly regarding luxury goods and branded items. I believe this will lead to a focus on requests related to these areas. As for the reasons behind the deficit, it has been indicated in surveys that international brands such as Visa and MasterCard are contributing factors. How do you perceive this?

Yes, this is indeed a common issue shared with digital Asia. Currently, there is a discussion that if we use AI, we must purchase American semiconductors, and when we search, money goes to American tech giants. The fact is that the United States has been nurturing international payment companies since the 1950s. As cashless transactions increase, it becomes easier for money to flow to these large American companies. This structure is becoming more evident. Therefore, the establishment of such platforms from the beginning is significant. Additionally, the payment sector relies heavily on networks.

Externalities tend to occur more easily when there are many users; the more individuals there are, the more public utility tends to increase. This leads to a tendency for market polarization to progress. I believe that such issues are occurring simultaneously. Does this situation not affect us as consumers? And is there no solution to resolve this deficit? Let's explore this further.

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クレカポイントの見直しも!? なぜ？訪日客増でカード会社赤字のワケ【NIKKEI NEWS NEXT】

クレカポイントの見直しも!? なぜ？訪日客増でカード会社赤字のワケ【NIKKEI NEWS NEXT】